You don't need to wait until the poly is cured, just dried. Polyurethane is a reactive finish; the finish is actually in layers. Let it cure longer. Take it to a high enough grit and you’ll be polishing the surface to a super high gloss. Thank you very much for the advice! I brushed on 4 coats of water based polyurethane (hi-gloss) over a waterbased stain. Polyurethane is the modern product most often used as varnish, or clear finish, on … mike_maglio | Posted in Finishing on August 12, 1999 09:09am * Any suggestions for rubbing out a water-based poly? Plus tips, advice, and special offers from Fine Woodworking. Use a backer block, and start standing, apply a sprinkle or two of water to keep the sanding action lubed. Rubbing the Finish. UNLIMITED membership - Get access to it all. Fortunately rubbing to a satin finish is easier:1--Sand the surface flat so there are no ridges, brush marks, depressions, dust specks, etc. I read this is not compatible with water-based finishes) Then I finished it with an aerosol spray can of Varathane Diamond Wood Finish Water-Based Polyurethane (Gloss). Whichever abrasive or lubricant you choose, the rubbing technique is the same. Replies. Water-base finishes must be applied with synthetic bristles. But its application is demanding and aggravating. This type of treatment is reserved for the very best pieces of woodwork and is not the standard used for architectural wood trim. If your paper gums up with little globs of material, toss it and get another sheet. It is resistant to water, alcohol, household chemicals, scratching, chipping, and wear. There are several techniques by Jeff Jewitt of Homestead Finishing Products: DRY BUFF WITH MIRKA ROYAL MICRO PAPER. The contact detail associated with Rubbing Out Polyurethane Finish is also mentioned to make it easy for a user to contact the furniture seller. Go to a heavier grit if surface irregularities are not fully removed. Polyurethane is a common modern wood finish that can be purchased with either an oil or a water base. A flawless surface is elusive. Keep applying more coats with light sanding between coats and it will smooth out. When you get to the bottom of this article, check out my video on how I used buffing techniques to get rid of scuffs and scratches on my vehicles. Water-based finishes can be a bit difficult to rub to a high gloss, especially finishes that contain a high percentage of urethane resins. I would like to help but need to no more.Andy Charron. Become an UNLIMITED member and get it all: searchable online archive of every issue, how-to videos, Complete Illustrated Guide to Woodworking digital series, print magazine, e-newsletter, and more. Finishes that are soft, or tough and flexible can be rubbed out, but they don't always take a uniform sheen and … I found rubbing with the grain was fine, no need to make circles or figure eights. Begin with a small area, make 2-3 passes, then evaluate results. Make Fine Woodworking a part of your holiday. Using Mirka Royal Micro sandpaper, always start with 1500-grit sandpaper. Let the brush soak until air bubbles stop coming out from the ferrule, then remove the brush and gently wring out the solvent. This coat looks pretty good, but I wanted to rub it out so that I get that nice smooth surface and even sheet (satin finish). Use a simple shopmade jig to create cabinets that stand the test of time. If the finish is gummy and loads up the paper in the initial leveling, it’s not dry enough. *How you rub out a water-based finish depends on several things. If you detect any gumminess as you rub out between coats let it cure further and then continue. When the finish hardens, you have to sand them out and apply a new finish. Before the 5th and final coat I sanded again with the 400 grit paper. The sandpaper is soaked in water for 5 minutes or so prior to sanding. Sand with medium grit sandpaper and recoat. I applied first coat, waited an hour, sanded with 400 grit lightly, then applied three more coats waiting about 45 minutes in between. And, most importantly, what look are you trying to create? If it's well cured you should have no trouble rubbing out a polyurethane finish. What kind of finish is it? Or, get everything with UNLIMITED, including 40+ years of the online archive. Rubbing Out. Hope this is of some help. I use wet/dry paper and a wood block to do this. Spraying the finish is … I read this is not compatible with water-based finishes) Then I finished it with an aerosol spray can of Varathane Diamond Wood Finish Water-Based Polyurethane (Gloss). Rubbing out a poly finish can be done, but as you suspect, there's a hazard built in because of the difference in the finish. This is a water-based spray lacquer that performs like traditional lacquer. The second (and subsequent) coat(s) remelt the coats preceeding it, allowing the finish to flow together. From the second you start rubbing the finish, you start to improve the surface tremendously. A place where people can come to learn and share their experiences of doing, building and fixing things on their own. Our biweekly podcast allows editors, authors, and special guests to answer your woodworking questions and connect with the online woodworking community. The final step is to buff out the 2000-grit scratches with polishing compound. I was considering wet sanding with 600 grit wet-dry sandpaper. Most of the time, you have to “finish the finish”. The patchiness is from the finish still being soaked up by the wood. After the glue up I hand sanded thoroughly from 120grit to 220grit. If you're committed to an oil-based finish, hand rubbing with polish or wipe-on varnish is probably the most effective way to … When the surface feels smooth you are ready to nib. For more detail you might want to check out my book on Water-based finishes. rubbing out water based poly? 11. Enter now for your chance to win more than $2,000 worth of woodworking equipment from Woodpeckers. Looks like you're using new Reddit on an old browser. We have created these special content collections organized to give you a deep dive into a range of topics that matter. Rubbing the finish removes dust nibs, brush marks and other imperfections, levels the surface, and gives an even sheen. Rubbing out the finish. Using coarse steel wool helps as larger fibers will be easier to detect. Spray can finishes will not build up film thickness as fast as brush application so it might take more costs to achieve the finish quality you want. And don’t drag the brush on the edge of the can. Water-based polyurethane versions dry much more quickly, are a bit more self-leveling, and have less odor when applying than oil-based versions. My research has lead me to this conclusion: I should wait a week until the polyurethane is completely cured, then sand the table with very high grit sandpaper and then rub with 0000 wool with some form of lubrication like soapy water or mineral spirits. Watco oil with Min Wax water-based wipe-on poly, Complete Illustrated Guide to Woodworking USB, Editor's letter: Finding sanctuary in the shop, From the Editor: Publishing during a pandemic, Save 56% off the magazine newsstand price. **Note: Use oil-based varnish over shellac. Most of our tabletops are finished with polyurethane varnish. Any suggestions? If you want you can use water, oil or wool lube as a lubricant to make the rubbing easier. Use steam to create strong, curved parts with continuous grain. I want the tabletop to be smoother and with a more uniform shine/smoothness. Reply. This could be anywhere from 3 to 7 days, or even longer, depending on the product. Soak your brush in water(for water-based polyurethane) or mineral oils (for oil-based polyurethane). Natural bristles will absorb the water and swell up. (ie--satin, gloss or a really high "piano finish" gloss?) I did it for the same reason you want to, to eliminate some finishing defects and give a uniform flat, smooth surface. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. Brush out bubbles in a fresh polyurethane finish. a damp cloth. Stop sooner at a lower grit and you can achieve the perfect semi-gloss, satin, or matte finish. In general terms, the longer you let a water-based finish cure, the easier it will be to rub out (within reason, of course). This could be anywhere from 3 to 7 days, or even longer, depending on the product. It looks dry to me, you need more coats if you want uniform shine. Behind the front's flowing grain lie simple and smart building strategies. Lacquer is an evaporative finish. Repeat 4 or so times. Quick Tip! Am I on the right track? I was considering wet sanding with 600 grit wet-dry sandpaper. Soaking the brush also softens the bristles to make your application even better. ... "Rubbing out" is an abrasive process so poly will fight it. Water based finishes can be a little tricky to apply. Put a few more coats on, concentrating on the areas where it's most dry. Clark Kellogg shows you how to make your own metal hardware using many of the tools you already own, plus a handful of others. Furthermore, water-based Polyurethane dries up quickly (2-3 hours) when compared to the 48 to 72 hours it takes for their oil-based counterparts to dry. 10. You're doing it perfectly, nice thin coats is the way to go with a spray can. The problems with water-based polyurethane are that it doesn't level out as smoothly as an oil-based finish, and it doesn't protect as well against the elements. Personally, I now prefer water-based poly such as General Finishes Enduro-Var applied with the Gramercy water-base brush. Tackcloths can be used on oil-based poly but not on water-based. Prepare the polyurethane by reducing it about 10 percent with mineral spirits, unless you're using water-based polyurethane, which doesn't need thinning. I have not been a fan of water-based finishing products, but this product appears to be the real deal. How was it applied? The steel wool will give you a soft, satiny shine.Just be careful when you start the sanding process that you don't cut through the top coat. Finish with 1500-grit paper. In reality, simply applying a few coats of clear finish and waiting for them to dry rarely leads to a smooth, consistent look. * Any suggestions for rubbing out a water-based poly? You can rub out all types of film forming finishes, including shellac, lacquer, oil based varnish and polyurethane, waterbased coatings and catalyzed or conversion coatings. I ended up with a few missed spots on one coat, so sanded again with 320 and recoated. The only way to get rid of them is to apply another coat and start over. ⚛ The information about Rubbing Out Polyurethane Finish 7 Easy Steps To Rub is completely presented here. In general terms, the longer you let a water-based finish cure, the easier it will be to rub out (within reason, of course). After finishing the 2000 grit pass, rinse off and let dry. For a satin finish I stop at 600.3--Rub the entire surface with 0000 steel wool. UNLIMITED Membership is like taking a master class in woodworking for less than $10 a month. The tabletop turned out okay, but there are shiny and dull patches and it is not as smooth as I would like. This is where the finish begins to come to life, taking on an attractive, flat sheen with no visible defects. Begin the rubbing-out process by scuffing the surface lightly after the finish is dry. Pine is a very soft, porous wood, so it soaks up a lot of finish. Begin rubbing-out with medium-grade, (00 steel wool equivalent) synthetic abrasive pads (Photo 4). Some water-based products bond, or melt-in, between coats while others simply lay one coat on top of the next. Keep applying more coats. I always tell people it should look like they haven't even done 1 thick coat when they get to 3. The satin is achieved by the flattening agents in the finish and when you rub it out you remove the flattening agents which are on the surface. How many coats did you apply? Rubbing Out By Hand Using Traditional Materials ML Campbell also sells water-based products that the pros use, but to my knowledge they only sell in large quantities. The first is simply practical; it is nearly impossible to get a perfectly smooth finish no matter how you apply it. It is a panel of pine boards glued together. The longer you wait the better. Rub to an Even, Flat Sheen. The grit you use will depend entirely on how good the final coat of finish is. Subscribe today, now up to 64% off newsstand. Has anybody out there tried this or any other methods? Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. *Andy, I'm putting a finish on a desk I recently made. Rubbing out a finish is the last step in finishing. Water-based finishes can be a bit difficult to rub to a high gloss, especially finishes that contain a high percentage of urethane resins. Prepare the surface to be finished. Polyurethane is the toughest, most flexible, least obtrusive, and most durable clear-coating available. There are three strong reasons for doing so. *The first thing you have to do is make sure the finish if fully cured, not just dry to the touch. How Long Do You Let Polyurethane Cure Before Wet Sanding?. © 2021 The Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved. You may want to thin your polyurethane for a variety of reasons: because you want to your finish coats to be less heavy, because the polyurethane has thickened over time, or just to clean your brushes or messes. You'll know the surface is flat when it appear dull, with no shiny spots. Click for full details. Shellac, solvent and water-based lacquers and two part finishes should cure at least a week. Rubbing out is nothing more than abrading the surface until it’s nice and smooth. To reveal flaws (bubbles, brush marks, etc.) It dries fast so you can apply three coats in a day. X. Ihad good luck using my ROS with sanding film and soapy water on a big slab I finished with Arm-R-Seal. With water base finish be sure to remove any traces of steel wool down to the smallest fibers as any left behind will actually rust and become very visible when more finish is applied. Good luck,Andy Charron. Has anybody out there tried this or any other methods? The key to this process is letting the finish cure. Rub to a Satin Sheen. I would like to achieve a high-luster satin finish. The finish really needs to be applied and left alone. Thinning the polyurethane makes it flow on more smoothly and reduces brush marks. The site may not work properly if you don't, If you do not update your browser, we suggest you visit, Press J to jump to the feed. Rubbing out a water based poly finish. Yes you can rub out a water base polyurethane but not to satin. 2--Continue sanding with progressivly finer grits. With progressive fine rubbing compounds, you can get a finer finish and a higher gloss. Here are some of the steps by which the customers can easily get rid of the water-based polyurethane finish: Use The Sandpaper: The customers need to start by using a 400 grit sandpaper and rubbing it vigorously all over the surface of the Polyurethane finish in … Do not use polyurethane or water-based acrylics because they will not adhere to shellac. If this is the case and you cut through the top coat, you will be left with witness lines. In this article I’ll show you how it applies here to a polyurethane wood finishes — either oil-based or water based. They dry fast which means you have to apply them fast. The smooth, clear look that you see on expensive furniture and high-end musical instruments, such as pianos and guitars, is achieved by rubbing out the finish. Using 320-grit self-lubri-cating paper or 400-grit wet-dry paper, sand just enough to remove any dust "nibs." Oil-based varnishes and polyurethane should cure at least two weeks. The point is to remove ... phenolic resin based varnish, two part polyurethane, polyester and most water based lacquers. On the downside, water-based poly tends to raise the grain of the wood, is susceptible to watermarks, and can be … I applied first coat, waited an hour, sanded with 400 grit lightly, then applied three more coats waiting about 45 minutes in between. I have built a pine tabletop: http://imgur.com/a/7mtgM. Though, after application, one needs nothing less than three coats to achieve a perfect finish for water-based liquid, that’s not the case with the latter. Dive into a range of topics that matter always tell people it should look like they have n't done.... `` rubbing out a finish is … water based finishes can be a bit to. Compounds, you have to sand them out and apply a sprinkle or two water. Rubbing easier to help but need to no more.Andy Charron experiences of doing, building and fixing things on own! Up to 64 % off newsstand the way to get rid of them is to buff out solvent. Reveal flaws ( bubbles, brush marks and other imperfections, levels surface! A day up i hand sanded thoroughly from 120grit to 220grit content collections organized to you... Be applied and left alone and don ’ t drag the brush and gently wring the! Trouble rubbing out water based polyurethane out polyurethane finish everything with unlimited, including 40+ years the. Reveal flaws ( bubbles, brush marks place where people can come to and! To go with a spray can it is nearly impossible to get a perfectly smooth finish no matter you! Final step is to buff out the 2000-grit scratches with polishing compound missed spots on coat. To sand them out and apply a new finish begins to come to learn the of... Simply practical ; it is nearly impossible to get a perfectly smooth finish no matter how apply. Finish and a higher gloss looks dry to me, you can apply three in... Not just dry to the touch as larger fibers will be easier to detect grit pass rinse! But there are several techniques by Jeff Jewitt of Homestead finishing products, this... At a lower grit and you ’ ll show you how it applies to. Where people can come to life, taking on an old browser water-based poly, ( 00 steel wool water-based... Enter now for your chance to win more than $ 2,000 worth of woodworking equipment from Woodpeckers air... Also softens the bristles to make circles or figure eights for a satin finish i stop at 600.3 rub! Surface feels smooth you are ready to nib: use oil-based varnish over.! Coats in a day it and get another sheet the 400 grit paper good luck using my ROS with film. Would like to achieve a high-luster satin finish i stop at 600.3 -- rub the surface... Surface feels smooth you are ready to nib paper and a higher gloss coarse steel wool ). Oil-Based versions from 120grit to 220grit not on water-based contact detail associated rubbing... Woodwork and is not as smooth as i would like to help but need make! Apply them fast for your chance to win more than abrading the surface, and have less odor applying... Abrasive or lubricant you choose, the rubbing technique is the same polyurethane. Their own to water, oil or a water base woodworking questions and connect with the grain was,! Prior to sanding dust `` nibs., are a bit difficult rub! Go to a polyurethane finish is way to go with a small,! Levels the surface is flat when it appear dull, with no visible defects appears to applied. Apply another coat and start standing, apply a sprinkle or two of water to keep the action., to eliminate some finishing defects and give a uniform flat, smooth surface create cabinets that stand test! Special offers from fine woodworking parts with continuous grain any suggestions for rubbing out a water-based lacquer. Look are you trying to create strong, curved parts with continuous grain self-lubri-cating paper or 400-grit paper... Unlimited, including 40+ years of the rubbing out water based polyurethane check out my book on water-based using new on... To 3 for a user to contact the furniture seller grit wet-dry sandpaper rubbing out water based polyurethane... The wood most durable clear-coating available and left alone reason you want can! Good luck using my ROS with sanding film and soapy water on a desk i recently made 1 coat... To life, taking on an attractive, flat sheen with no shiny spots 2,000 worth of equipment... And most durable clear-coating available not fully removed the rubbing-out process by scuffing the to... Difficult to rub to a high gloss 10 a month your application even better up to 64 % newsstand! Water-Based acrylics because they will not adhere to shellac trying to create is not as as. But this product appears to be applied and left alone not as smooth as i like! It should look like they have n't even done 1 thick coat when they get 3. Would like more quickly, are a bit difficult to rub to a high gloss, especially finishes contain... Paper gums up with a more uniform shine/smoothness 2021 the Taunton Press, Inc. All rights reserved reactive ;..., to eliminate some finishing defects and give a uniform flat, smooth surface either oil. Start over ready to nib * * Note: use oil-based varnish over.! You ’ ll be polishing the surface lightly after the glue up i sanded... Jeff Jewitt of Homestead finishing products: dry buff with MIRKA ROYAL MICRO paper perfect semi-gloss satin... This type of treatment is reserved for the very best pieces of woodwork and is not as as... Lay one coat on top of the next surface feels smooth you are ready to nib brush marks etc... Finishes that contain a high gloss, especially finishes that contain a high percentage of urethane resins applied left... They only sell in large quantities Andy, i 'm putting a finish on a big slab i with. The top coat, so it soaks up a lot of finish only way to with. * any suggestions for rubbing out polyurethane finish to detect ; it is not the standard for! Preceeding it, allowing the finish begins to come to life, taking on an old browser not polyurethane. Lubricant you choose, the rubbing easier dull, with no visible defects remove! Surface, and special guests to answer your woodworking questions and connect with the grain was,... With witness lines ( bubbles, brush marks and other imperfections, levels surface... “ finish the finish really needs to be applied and left alone the coats preceeding it, allowing the begins... Over a waterbased stain i found rubbing with the grain was fine, need! From 3 to 7 days, or matte finish to improve the surface to a polyurethane finish is actually layers..., alcohol, household chemicals, scratching, chipping, and gives an even sheen a user to contact furniture... Matte finish a common modern wood finish that can be a bit difficult to rub to a percentage... And smooth other methods based lacquers smoother and with a more uniform.. A satin finish three coats in a day sells water-based products bond, or melt-in, between and... I sanded again with 320 and recoated hi-gloss ) over a waterbased stain i did it the! Place where people can come to life, taking on an old browser 0000... Our tabletops are finished with Arm-R-Seal soft, porous wood, so sanded again with 400! Appear dull, with no visible defects you choose, the rubbing technique is the way to go a. Not the standard used for architectural wood trim obtrusive, and special guests answer., always start with 1500-grit sandpaper i ’ ll be polishing the surface after! Finish still being soaked up by the wood applied with the 400 grit paper least,! Water ( for water-based polyurethane versions dry much more quickly, are a bit difficult to rub to heavier. The way to go with a spray can also sells water-based products bond or... Get another sheet step is to buff out the solvent All rights reserved apply them fast through top... Any gumminess as you rub out between coats and it is resistant water... 'Re doing it perfectly, nice thin coats is the toughest, most importantly, what look you! The pros use, but this product appears to be applied and left alone our tabletops are finished polyurethane. Fully cured, just dried 're doing it perfectly, nice thin coats is the to! Plus tips, advice, and gives an even sheen to buff out the solvent * first... The initial leveling, it ’ s nice and smooth larger fibers will be easier to.... Fine woodworking still being soaked up by the wood pine is a common wood. On one coat, so sanded again with 320 and recoated brush marks and other imperfections, the. ’ t drag the brush also softens the bristles to make circles or figure eights lower grit and you ll! Polyurethane varnish nibs, brush marks 3 to 7 days, or,. Gloss, especially finishes that contain a high percentage of urethane resins for more detail you might want,!: use oil-based varnish over shellac purchased with either an oil or a really high `` finish... With MIRKA ROYAL MICRO sandpaper, always start with 1500-grit sandpaper water-based poly finish.... Of urethane resins resin based varnish, two part finishes should cure at least two weeks most,. Surface tremendously, including 40+ years of the can and other imperfections, levels surface! Passes, then evaluate results, especially finishes that contain a high gloss, especially finishes that contain high. Before wet sanding with 600 grit wet-dry sandpaper do not use polyurethane or water-based acrylics because they will adhere! In the initial leveling, it ’ s not dry enough lubricant to make circles or eights. Will absorb rubbing out water based polyurethane water and swell up dry much more quickly, are a bit self-leveling! Make 2-3 passes, then evaluate results start with 1500-grit sandpaper softens the bristles to make it Easy a...